Of Lonhro And Other Greats

The power of the blog .... received an interesting email from Kyle Pratt who, through the wonders of the internet, latched on to this blog in London. He read a passing reference to Lonhro in one of my stallion pieces and was moved to write. Kyle knows his horses, and writes well too, and kindly agreed that I could reproduce his email, to which I've added my reply and his subsequent reply to that.

Kyle wrote:

"I am an Australian on a working holiday in London. I came across your blog when I was on my daily perusal of that champion little website ‘Racenet’. I must say I do enjoy reading your articles and am also a fan of your writing style.

"It is fair to say I am horse mad. I love racing, love going to the sales, and love talking horses……..with anybody. I used to work for trainer Danny Bougoure in the good old days when he had Falvelon, Scenic Peak, and my favourite little horse Nauders, who ran the most unlucky of thirds in Prized Gem’s Brisbane Cup.

"I am writing to express my thoughts on a horse called Lonhro. My opinion seems to be at the opposite end of the spectrum with those who are willing to broach the subject with me.

"When we speak of ‘out and out champions’ of the turf from the last 10 years in Australian racing the names Might and Power, Sunline, Northerly, Makybe Diva and Lonhro are thrown forward immediately. I personally do not have a place for Lonhro along side the other four I have identified.

"These champions, with the exception of Lonhro, have all have done something extraordinary on the track. Might and Power’s Melbourne Cup, Caulfield Cup and Cox Plate. Sunline’s Cox Plates and Doncasters. Northerly’s Cox Plates and Caulfield Cup. Makybe Diva we need not discuss.

"I don’t believe Lonhro ever produced a racetrack performance to rival the deeds of these four. If I had to choose a race in which Lonhro achieved something truly amazing I would propose his Australian Cup win. Watching the race gave me goose bumps at the time. Watching him win in the last bound after a chequered path down the straight was something to see, and I am happy I did manage to watch it live. If only the horses he beat were top notch gallopers in their prime, they were not. Second place was Delzao who proved himself to be a horse of Group 2 standard. In third place was Elvstroem as an autumn 3yo in what turned out to be the worst preparation of his stellar career.

"His deeds as a 3yo were tremendous, undefeated and claiming his first Group 1, the Caulfield Guineas.

"Lonhro failed to win any of his grand finals in four preparations as a four and five year old. As a spring 4yo his mission was the Cox Plate. As an autumn 4yo his mission was the Doncaster. As a spring 5yo his mission was once again the Cox Plate. As an autumn 5yo his mission was to be his racing swansong, the AJC Queen Elizabeth Stakes. (I could be a little biased here as the Australian Cup was also a race of interest for connections.) Many excuses were made for these failures. I simply believe he was not good enough.

"Lonhro’s ‘thing’ was racing in small WFA fields where his acceleration was explosive enough to run over the top of the leaders and win. He was certainly good enough to do this as his record suggests.

"For any horse to win 26 races and 11 Group 1’s is a brilliant achievement. Few horses achieve this feat. This being the case, why is it that Lonhro managed to bank only just shy of $5.8 million? This is because he never won any ‘big’ races for a horse held in his esteem. Races like the Mackinnon Stakes are qualified as ‘big’ races if the horse you own is Oliver Twist. Races like the Caulfield Stakes are big races if the horse you own is Maldivian.

"Is it possible that Lonhro’s reputation has a silver lining because he was from the first crop of his champion father Octagonal?

"I am not saying Lonhro was ordinary, he was a great horse with an exceptional record, just not quite as good as others mentioned in the same breath. I dearly hope the horse succeeds at stud; it would be a shame if he didn’t.

"I would be interested in your thoughts on this matter."

I replied to Kyle, as follows:

Kyle

Thanks for the kind words.

Lonhro an out-and-out-champion? He probably doesn't belong in the pantheon of the supernatural and your critique sums him up quite objectively in my opinion - you do give credit where credit is due, no muggins wins 26/11 G1s of any description.

He is such an atypical Octagonal. I always thought he looked like a dark brown Straight Strike (God forbid he looks like a First Consul!). But he had great brilliance, power and killer instinct and he had a trainer who prepared and placed him flawlessly. As you point out, there was the odd day he didn't scale the heights. Grand Armee had two famous victories over him; in the Doncaster Grand Armee was at the top of his game and was aided by the fast lane, while we were pretty confident we'd roll Lonhro in his Queen Elizabeth swansong - irrespective of what's been said of Beadman's ride, I am sure Lonhro was not at his best that day and Grand Armee sure was.

What can be said with certainty is that few of the horses that beat Lonhro are going to have an opportunity to perpetuate the breed. Only three colts ever finished ahead of him in his career - Dash For Cash who was second in the Doncaster with Lonhro fourth, Spectatorial who was third in the Blue Diamond with Lonhro fourth (and hurt during running), and Grandera who was third in the 2002 Cox Plate with Lonhro sixth. I think that is the great significance of Lonhro in terms of the opportunity he has to influence the breed in years to come.

Lonhro has a challenge ahead of him in terms of perpetuating a sire line which has given us so much: Lonhro-Octagonal-Zabeel-Sir Tristram. Usually it doesn't survive beyond three generations. Star Kingdom did, though possibly Show A Heart is the last gasp for him (5th generation tail-male descendant).

Though he was a gelding and though he didn't win a Cox Plate or a Melbourne Cup (a highly questionable ride), Tie The Knot, to my way of thinking, is an oft-forgotten equine hero. He was wonderful to look at, both when he was standing still and in motion - I don't know if I've seen a horse with a better action or more determination. He personified the thoroughbred.

Interesting to read that you were associated with Falvelon. I saw him when he was out for a pick of grass at Randwick one afternoon and it looked like you could hop over him, he was that small. But I saw Lyphard and Blushing Groom in the flesh, too, and they were ponies. Despite his 'unfashionable' pedigree, I thought Falvelon had an interesting make-up which gave him a decent chance at stud. His early figures are better than some of his more vaunted contemporaries and he is a value horse in my opinion. But those horses standing in Queensland seem to have a devil of a job making national impact.

PS: Chillidapper (part of Kyle's email address) is an interesting email address. He was honest, but no Lonhro.

And Kyle has followed up with:

"I am also happy that you touched on Tie The Knot being a tremendous racehorse which is often forgotten.

"In the 90's there were no horses winning multiple Cox Plates or Melbourne Cups. Since about 2000 we have been blessed with those I have mentioned in my last email. All those horses went on to win $9 million plus with the exception of Might and Power who had his career cut short with injury.

"I can only assume that if we had not seen these recent champions then we would probably hold Tie The Knot in the same ilk as a Super Impose for example. The one accolade which Tie The Knot looked certain to grab was the number one position on the all time money earners list. Then along came Sunline, then Northerly, then Makybe Diva.

"Tie The Knot won 13 Group 1's and also had a Ranvet Stakes taken off him on protest by, if my memory serves me correctly, Darazari. Sunline also won 13 Group 1's and was involved in a Cox Plate protest involving Northerly and Viscount. As much as I love Sunline I believe the Stewards got it right on this occasion, I am not so confident about Tie The Knot's Ranvet Stakes decision.

"I personally was not a Tie The Knot fan early on in his career. It took me a little time to forgive him for beating my all time favourite galloper, Doriemus, in a Sydney Cup. First and foremost I am a lover of racing, therefore, it was only natural for me to change my opinion on the handsome chestnut. I could not have been happier when he won his fourth Chipping Norton Stakes as a 7yo. Any horse that wins Group 1's in 5 seasons deserves the highest of praise.

"In conclusion, I am suggesting that if he equalled Kingston Town’s record of 14 Group 1's, or held the all time money record for a period of time, we might possibly hold him higher in the 'pantheon of the supernatural'. Regardless, he was an oustanding horse.

"Chillidapper - Any horse which wins the last race on Grafton Cup day three years running is alright by me."
..............................................................................................................................................................................

As I say in the heading to this blog, A Horse Race Is Just A Difference Of Opinion!

11 comments:

Anonymous said...

Oooh, this is a very moot subject...the time honoured discussion of what constitutes a 'champion', a term frequently and brazenly abused.At the risk of becoming a serial commentator, I have to get in my two bobs worth.

Clearly a number of qualities align to render a champion. Consistent and multiple success at the highest level, exceptional acceleration or will to win (preferably at a variety of distances) and perhaps the least vaunted of all, longevity. The latter's inclusion is based on the notion that soundness, constitution and the capacity to run through pain are vital ingredients in perpetuating a great career.

I realise you're only talking about the last decade but there's really only been one champ in my time. I can recall seeing Kingston Town touch up a WFA field over 1100ms and a couple of months later unleashing that blinding sprint to towel his rivals in a Sydney Cup! Fair to say he ticked every box.

Manikato came close. You just don't win Golden Slippers and 4 William Reids', the last at age 7! To be fair, most contemporary Slipper winners are denied the chance because of the commercial attraction of the stud but I'm prepared to punt that none of them could have matched 'The Man'.

Rubiton won everything in the spring of '87 (bar the Caulfield Stakes after running away on the track that week) but broke down soon after. Which places him in the honourable mention set and only serves to highlight the significance of longevity.

Over the years there've been a stack of candidates to rate an honourable mention.Obviously the likes of Might and Power, Northerly, Sunline and Makybe Diva are automatic members of this category.

Tie the Knot is also a worthy contender, if only on the grounds of longevity at the top. He was a freakishly sound horse whose 62 sts included 32 in Group 1 company.
From the autumn of '98 when he won his first Sydney Cup and two years later when he contested his third, he'd raced in two Melbourne Cups and a total of five Group Ones over 3200ms in two and a half years! Can't recall another horse doing that as most who've attempted it break down. When you consider the ks required in races and on the track to be fit enough to race over these trips, it's little wonder he was over it by the last one.

Like Tie the Knot, Lonhro didn't win a 'major' but as you point out Steve, he was the first colt home in so many of his races. And this is the point. For a bull to win a Blue Diamond Prelude in the summer of 2000/01, then 30 odd runs and 24stakes wins later to dispose of a quality George Ryder field as an autumn 5yo, says plenty for his excellence.

Whether Lonhro cuts it at stud remains to be seen (I have no view either way) but there's no colonial horse standing at present that would get within a bull's roar of his record. Hats off to Bob for racing him on.

Doubt we'll see a 'champion' colt in our time. They're not around long enough to truly prove themselves. That's an unfortunate economic reality. Still, there'll be no shortage of mares and geldings keeping the 'champion' debate alive.

Anonymous said...

At the risk of turning this blog into a pure retrospective, mention of the 'two milers' evokes memories us baby boomers have of horses who were around in the heyday of NZ racing, from the time of the Beatles until the early '90s.

In New Zealand, where producing the stayer was a proud achievement until breeders were conned and hijacked by their Australian counterparts, four two-milers come quickly to mind - Great Sensation, Il Tempo, Castletown and Ebony Honor.

In January 1960, Great Sensation finished 3rd in the Wellington Cup, then 2nd in the Autumn Handicap. He was to win the next three Wellington Cups on the trot, the last of them at age 10. He beat Ilumquh and Stipulate in two of them. That's Makybe Diva stuff (though being a mare she is truly a freak).

Il Tempo was an astounding two-miler. He was by Time And Again-Timing. Between January 1968 and March 1970 he won two Auckland Cups and a Wellington Cup, a Chalmers Handicap and was also 2nd in both the Auckland and Wellington Cups. He carried huge weights, ran fast times and was ridden by the unfashionable but thoroughly gentlemanly Noel Riordan.

The daddy of them all is probably Castletown. Between January 1991 and January 1994 he won or placed in 9 'two-mile' events, winning 3 Wellington Cups, an Auckland Cup, twice placing in the Sydney Cup, placing in a Melbourne Cup, a New Zealand Cup and a further Auckland Cup. Incredibly, he was by the sprinter One Pound Sterling.

Then there's Ebony Honor. He never won over 3200m so doesn't stand comparison with the above. But between January 2001 and January 2005 he contested 11 such G1 events, placing in 7 of them.

In the rush to get this on the blog before taking the plane to NZ for the Karaka sales I've probably missed other worthy contenders. But if longevity, constitution and soundness are characteristics to be admired, these guys had them in spades.

I know we've had this discussion before, Jamie, but it does seem as every year goes by the function and purpose of Australian racing, guided by the ever-increasing influence of the breeders' lobby, is to sell stallion nominations. Hence the short-lived 'champions' and the certainty that the Melbourne Cup will be 1600m one day.

Anonymous said...

Before I make my contribution I would just like to say that I agree with Jamie (above) and Kyle, that Lonhro is not a champion in the true sense of the word. I won't bother elaborating because I think between the two of them they have got it right. However I would like to offer some food for thought....You will all remember Bill Whittaker who wrote for the SMH. In April 2004 he wrote an article which has resonated with me to this day. It is one of the most interesting racing articles I have ever had the pleasure of reading. Here are two excerpts I would like to highlight for your consideration and remember, this is coming from a seasoned thoroughbred expert - "Lonhro may not be everyone's champion but I am as certain as one can be about anything in racing that he is the finest racehorse seen in Sydney since Kingston Town's retirement 22 years ago.Further, Lonhro is possessed of the fastest finishing speed at distances of 1400 metres to 2000m of any horse I have seen and that includes every top-class horse at Randwick in the past 60 years. Yes, faster than Bernborough, Shannon, Flight, Todman, Carioca, Tulloch, Sky High, Tobin Bronze, Gallilee, Rising Fast, Red Craze, Kingston Town, Vain, Gunsynd, Wenona Girl, Super Impose, Might And Power, Northerly, Saintly, Tie The Knot and Sunline." Like I said, food for thought....

Anonymous said...

I still get shivers when anyone discusses Il Tempo, one of my all-time favourites (another being Mayo Gold).

Steve, you touched on his incredible record and I'd like to expand it ever-so-slightly.

Il Tempo was never unplaced in seven starts over 2 miles.

As for weight, I think he carried 9.12 in the Chalmers and here's the kicker - he won the Auckland Cup, Wellington Cup and Chalmers Hcp all in the space of 63 days!

Reminiscing isn't what it used to be.......

Anonymous said...

Oooh, Jamie.... to say the great Mare belongs in the HONOURABLE MENTION SET defies logic and contradicts your second paragraph and you've obviously suffered memory loss with your summation of longevity outlining Tie the Not as an example. Remember Makybe Diva, anyone! I'll try and stick to the facts.

First Prep wins six straight, goes from a Wangaratta maiden to a G2 Victory. Tick 1.

Second prep, two starts unplaced! Only blot on the career! But is it? The shrewd D.Hall has already qualified her for the Cup, maybe this prep is part of the grand plan. Cross ?

Third Prep, Wins the Cup at fifth start in after unlucky run in Caulfield Cup, one lenght 4th at first WFA start in G2 Turnbull third up. Tick 2.

Fourth Prep, Wins the Sydney Cup at sixth start in, runs third in WFA races the Ranvet and BMW prior. Tick 3.

Fifth Prep, Wins second Cup at fifth start in, 2nd in the WFA Feehan 2nd up and 2nd in the Caulfield Cup, getting closer! Tick 4.

Sixth Prep, Wins the WFA Australian Cup third up then Wins WFA BMW, 2nd in WFA St George prior to these, then runs unplaced in Japan over 2000m and 3200m, written off by most! Tick 5.

Seventh Prep, Wins the WFA Memsie first up over 1400m, beating WFA 1400m G1 horses Regal Roller and Barely a Moment, then runs 2nd in the WFA Feehan 2nd up, then Wins WFA Turnbull, WFA Cox Plate and her third Cup in a row. Tick 6.

15 Wins all up from 36 starts.

*5 Wins and 4 Placings at WFA from 1400m to 2400m. Tick 7.
*8 Wins on a track rated Good. Tick 8.
*4 Wins on a track rated Slow or Heavy. Tick 9.
*Wins consistently in both Melb and Syd. Tick 10.
*Wins from 1400m at WFA to 3200m Hcp. Tick 11.
*Wins four 3200m races from 5 attempts within a two year period. Tick 12
That’s a dozen Ticks and a doubtful cross!
Honourable mention! Think not.
Wet Track Stayer! Think Not
Champion! Think So?

Anonymous said...

Sorry anonymous, you can't convince me!

Excuse my delayed response but have been at Karaka and have just noticed your piece.

Makybe Diva was a great staying mare, of that there is no dispute. One of the best STAYERS we've seen but she falls short of champion class through being relatively ineffective over shorter courses.

Yes, I know she won a Memsie but her overall record at distances less than 2000ms reads this way...3-3-1 from 15 sts of which only one was at the highest level. She ran 7th to Elvstroem in the Orr. Hardly the stuff of "champions".

Kingston Town would have pulled a cart and beaten her at anything up to 2400ms. KT's record inside 2000ms puts Makybe in the shade...15-1-1 from 19 tries including three Group One victories!

Over the longer trips Kingston Town scrubs up alright...15-4-1 from 22 outings. No less than 11 of those 15 wins were Group Ones!!!

By comparison Makybe stepped out 20 times at 2000ms and beyond for a dozen triumphs (7 Group Ones) a second and 2 thirds.

I would also passively make this point. Makybe was a fortunate recipient of the contemporary trend to condense the weights in major handicaps.

In the last 10-15 years the VRC has turned the Melb Cup into a Quality Hcp as race clubs generally bow to the commercial attraction of a marquee starter in a major race. By alloting absurdly attractive handicaps to quality performers and compressing the weights overall, the invitation to run is very clear. And at the same time the traditional 'handicap' concept is diluted..rendering the task of the emerging horse exceedingly difficult.

Champion horses carrying the grandstand to eclipse the lightly weighted rising stars typifies the very spirit of handicap racing. As good as Makybe was, her greatness has to be questioned when she was so flattered at the weights.

How this grand mare got in with 58kgs for her third and final Melb Cup is beyond me! Perhaps I should ask the marketers and event organisers.

Having polished off her rivals the year before with 55.5kg, Makybe proceeded to bag an Aust Cup and a Tancred before being asked to carry just 2.5kg more a year later!

Think Big carried 52kg in his first Melb Cup and repeated the effort 12 mths later with 58.5kg having won nothing in between! Rain Lover carried 51.5kg to victory and then lumped 60.5kg the next year.

Comparing eras is always dodgy. However the "conditions" of the Melb Cup have been surreptitiously altered. Who knows, she may still have won 3 Cups with a more appropriate weight. But a doubt exists.

By the way anonymous, I never intended to nominate Tie the Knot in the champion class. He was a great horse, extraordinarily sound and competitive at the highest level through 4 seasons of racing. But not a champion as such...I was suggesting he was "a contender for an honourable mention".

Steve, am happy to reveal some of those names preceded me though I do recall Castletown and Il Tempo. Sounds like you'd have needed an axe to break down Castletown!

Chester said...

While not in the same class as the other 2 milers you mention, old Magistrate contested 14 x 3200m races, winning the Perth Cup twice with placings at Auckland & Wellington, & a fourth at Flemingt0n.

STEVE BREM said...

Definitely in the honourable mention class, Magistrate. His mileage on the track was equalled only by his mileage off the track! As a racing editor at the time, I led a press campaign to reinstate the horse when he was unjustly banned mid-career as a barrier rogue. Nothing about him was fashionable, neither his owner-trainer nor his breeding. He was by Count Rendered's son Stipulate, a fine performer who won both the Auckland and New Zealand Cups and defeated Even Stevens at WFA at their peak. I saw Magistrate's frequent rider Bob Skelton at the recent Karaka sales, looking pretty spritely.

STEVE BREM said...

kloyd0306's passing mention above of Mayo Gold sure does stir the memory juices. There were three high class NZ fillies around her time which make today's "stars" like Miss Finland look like mere powderpuffs. They said Mayo Gold (Gold Sovereign) would 'never come back' after a 2YO season of 17 starts for 8 wins and 7 placings. In fact she just got better, ending with career figures of 50:18-11-4, and became a decent broodmare. Then there was tiny Yir Tiz (Bismark II), also subjected to 17 starts at two for 11 wins. She endured 46 career starts, winning 15 as well as placing in both the Stradbroke and Oakleigh Plate. Her son Mr Tiz (Bletchingly) is as good a sprinter as I've seen. Then there was Judena (Zephyr Bay) who was made of tungsten: 20 starts at two for 5 wins and 7 placings, but a career total of 56:11-10-1 which included an Oaks and a St Leger! Though she didn't have quite the same volume of early racing as this trio, Wenona Girl is an oft-overlooked Australan champion from the post-war era. Her record is an extraordinary 68:27-19-7 and I think 15 of those wins either were or are now regarded as G1 events. Like Emancipation, Wenona Girl was sold off to New Zealand at an advanced age where she was able to make, with time, a positive contribution. Her great-grandson Scaredee Cat was the sire of the $300,000 record-breaking sale topper at the recent Karaka Select Yearling Sale.

Anonymous said...

Jamie............ some interesting points about the great Mare; however I believe your argument is slightly distorted. I pose the question to you if you owned her? Why try and win sprints and races under 2000m worth $300 to $500k when the main goal is to win $3-$5 million dollar races at the end of the prep with light weights!

I agree entirely about the current handicapping Methods - fancy Sunline being allotted 58kg in her Second Doncaster Win after previously winning 11 Group 1's including two Cox Plates!

My point with Maybe and it's purely speculative - is that I believe she could have won a Newmarket, Doncaster, etc if she was set for it? Dare I mention the underrated Mahogany!

Confirming my beliefs are the facts and form from her last preparation. After winning everything that she was prepared for as a stayer - two years running, there wasn't much left to achieve except winning the Cox Plate.

Hence the strategy during her last prep in which she achieved her owner’s goal of winning the Cox Plate; and on the way knocked off some competent G1 horses within their own sprint distances, the Melbourne Cup that year was an added bonus.

TJ ran that freakish Black Champion in everything except his home town Cup at Carathool. The training methods and major race / cups prizemoney are worlds apart in the eras Makybe and the King competed.

Maybe we shouldn't try and compare Champions from different eras, although I did see Sampras beat Federer the other day, I wonder would Borg beat him though?

I guess my initial reason for replying to your comments was that you put the Great Mare in the HONOURABLE MENTION set with the most overrated animal of all time in Might and Power!

He belongs with Ethereal, Doriemus, Let’s Elope, Super Impose, etc.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous....Know what you're saying. Who's to say a lot of gifted horses' records couldn't have been re-written had connections not succumbed to the lure of money, international prestige, stud value etc. And you and I would probably do the same thing!

Perhaps Makybe could have been trained for shorter races but the point is this...true champions do it anyway! That elite group constantly defy the figures and convention as they relentlessly achieve what mere mortals can't.

I must also make the point that Makybe was beautifully handled throughtout her stellar career. David Hall placed her impeccably and showed exquisite patience particularly in the autumn of 2003 (limiting her prep to 2 runs). I think this was a very significant contributor to her DEVELOPMENT as a stayer and arguably enabled her to blossom later on.

Under Lee Freedman's expert guidance as an older, mature, seasoned competitor she was suddenly able to win a Memsie (could only finish 4th 12mths earlier). Notwithstanding different training and the owner's Cox Plate aspirations in her last campaign, it's fair to conclude Makybe gradually improved with age...4th in the 2003 Caulfield Cup, 2nd in 04. Sixth in the Aust Cup of 04, won it in 05. She ran third in the 04 Tancred then won it a year later and was unplaced in both the 03 and 04 Turnbulls before winning it in 05.

Think that 'improvement' was the principle reason for her devastating final spring rather than being specifically set for the Cox Plate.

Don't know if 'training methods' in different eras are 'worlds apart'. JB Cummings has been an exemplary trainer for over 40 years and I suspect his fundamentals haven't altered much. Maybe he prepares a few more precocious colts these days responding to the industry trend.

Granted, Kingston Town had plenty of racing but that surely is another component that adds to his 'champion' qualities.

Also not sure Might and Power was that overated. Horses just don't lead all the way in Caulfield Cups and win by 6! Then to prove it was no fluke he's led from barrier to box in a Melb Cup? And for good measure returned 12mths and 4 Group Ones' later to claim a Cox Plate. He was no Makybe but he was pretty tidy all the same.